Okay, so here we are. I am a bit late getting this up, but I'm just now beginning to get over being sick, and was finally able to finish transcribing the audio. Not much to say, but I hope you all enjoy reading this as much as I enjoyed doing it.
Much thanks to the awesome Leon Bing for agreeing to this interview. I can't think of a better person to serve as my final interview subject.
So enjoy, folks.
EDIT: Once again there's an issue with formatting. Blogger's buggy, and now there's a background color to my text. If I change it to white, it leaves a distracting white background to the text and so I picked the least distracting shade of color. Apologies.
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SFCB: It seems that a
common refrain that we hear these days is that everything needs to be
privatized. Whether it's prisons, health
care, or colleges we have seen that when
they are for profit, that these institutions nearly always fail at actually
helping people, and in the case of for profit prisons, you often have situations where judges are taking bribes to sentence kids to detention centers or prisons, because the more people inside, the more money the people in authority get.
LEON BING: And the more people you have inside, the more trouble.
SFCB: Yeah, and it creates this cycle where some of these people may not have been bad people when they went in, but often they are when they come out.
LEON BING: I mean the rate of recidivism is enormous. And the college courses are diminishing in many prisons, not all but many. And it is a time for people to get their GED's. I think that's still going, but there used to be college courses, and there still may be, but they are diminishing. You know, stuff by mail, and by computer and in the library, and all of that stuff is diminishing because because it doesn't make enough money.
SFCB: When you have for profit health systems you end up with two paths you can follow: Either follow the path of helping people and follow the Hippocratic Oath of "First Do No Harm" or you can follow the capitalist path of "First Make A Profit". I'm not sure you can do both effectively.
LEON BING: And the more people you have inside, the more trouble.
SFCB: Yeah, and it creates this cycle where some of these people may not have been bad people when they went in, but often they are when they come out.
LEON BING: I mean the rate of recidivism is enormous. And the college courses are diminishing in many prisons, not all but many. And it is a time for people to get their GED's. I think that's still going, but there used to be college courses, and there still may be, but they are diminishing. You know, stuff by mail, and by computer and in the library, and all of that stuff is diminishing because because it doesn't make enough money.
SFCB: When you have for profit health systems you end up with two paths you can follow: Either follow the path of helping people and follow the Hippocratic Oath of "First Do No Harm" or you can follow the capitalist path of "First Make A Profit". I'm not sure you can do both effectively.
Why do you think that there's this urge by politicians to
privatize everything and make things all about making money rather than
honestly trying to help people?
LEON BING: Well I don't like to blanket 'all politicians', it's not all politicians. But, money is the siren call for that. It's also the carrot at the end of the stick. It's what the donkey move, you know. And that's the only answer I really have to give.
The normal remedy was “toughen up” or “man up”, or any of
those types of things.
LEON BING: You know, it's very interesting that you say that. Aside from being a very brilliant photographer, my Gareth.... Gareth Siegel, heads up a department and teaches Special Ed. Math. His school, here in Pasadena, the kids he taught - he teaches a lot of stuff, not just math. He worked with kids on their essays, and the essays were for a contest, and they won.
SFCB: Alright, that's cool.
LEON BING: He is a brilliant teacher, and he really cares about these Special Ed kids. He treats everyone as if they have huge potential, and they do.
SFCB: Right. And now these days it’s a lot better than it was, as far as our understanding of mental health and that it doesn’t mean someone is stupid or less intelligent because they are depressed. However it’s still got a ways to go.
LEON BING: My God, we've got such a ways to go.
SFCB: Well, what do you think can be done to combat that idea of mental health issues = weakness?
LEON BING: You know, it's very interesting that you say that. Aside from being a very brilliant photographer, my Gareth.... Gareth Siegel, heads up a department and teaches Special Ed. Math. His school, here in Pasadena, the kids he taught - he teaches a lot of stuff, not just math. He worked with kids on their essays, and the essays were for a contest, and they won.
SFCB: Alright, that's cool.
LEON BING: He is a brilliant teacher, and he really cares about these Special Ed kids. He treats everyone as if they have huge potential, and they do.
SFCB: Right. And now these days it’s a lot better than it was, as far as our understanding of mental health and that it doesn’t mean someone is stupid or less intelligent because they are depressed. However it’s still got a ways to go.
LEON BING: My God, we've got such a ways to go.
SFCB: Well, what do you think can be done to combat that idea of mental health issues = weakness?
LEON BING: Well, you know, that's beyond wrong. That's stunningly wrong. A mental health is just that. And it's treatable. unless we're talking about a psychotic, it's treatable. It's pathology. and so it's not even that. Almost everyone has something. You know I certainly have a touch of OCD. I have to touch the same part of the same wall while I'm walking my dog.
SFCB: But you're not like Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets, where he's got like 86 boxes of soap, and he takes one out, uses it once and throws it away? (laughs)
LEON BING: No, no it's little things. Like there's a certain part of a wall I touch every time when I walk by. I don't know what will happen if I don't, but I know I have to.
SFCB: I'm sort of like that with organizing media, like I have a ton of music files, and I have to have them labeled just right, constantly setting them up in little folders, and having them named a certain way.
LEON BING: Oh come and fix my files (laughs)
SFCB: But you're not like Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets, where he's got like 86 boxes of soap, and he takes one out, uses it once and throws it away? (laughs)
LEON BING: No, no it's little things. Like there's a certain part of a wall I touch every time when I walk by. I don't know what will happen if I don't, but I know I have to.
SFCB: I'm sort of like that with organizing media, like I have a ton of music files, and I have to have them labeled just right, constantly setting them up in little folders, and having them named a certain way.
LEON BING: Oh come and fix my files (laughs)
SFCB: With your history as a model with Rudi Gernreich I
wanted to ask you your thoughts on the state of modeling today, and how there’s
so much pressure on young girls to live up to images in magazines and on
billboards, that often are products of heavy photo manipulation and
makeup.
This in essence creates an impossible standard of beauty to live up to, and in turn there are young girls out there who seek out drastic measures such as starving themselves or even young teen girls seeking plastic surgery to live up to said impossible standards. Dove put out this video, I can't remember if I sent it to you or not, called "The Evolution of Beauty" and it --
This in essence creates an impossible standard of beauty to live up to, and in turn there are young girls out there who seek out drastic measures such as starving themselves or even young teen girls seeking plastic surgery to live up to said impossible standards. Dove put out this video, I can't remember if I sent it to you or not, called "The Evolution of Beauty" and it --
LEON BING:, No, No, I know all about this. Mind you the plastic surgery is certainly not without parental consent. So the parents have to come in for a little of the blame if there's blame to be had. I don't blame the girls. I don't blame anyone. It's models. I was a model. And you either take it so seriously that you become an idiot, or you do it as a very well paying job that is a job nonetheless, and you thank God that you were given the tools, the looks, so you could do it.
You hear this about "Oh it's so boring", well, too bad! You get paid to be bored." You know? Bring a book! So you know I don't have a lot of patience for that. It's like the actor who says "Oh "I'm really so shy. I can't stand the bear the glare, or the eyes on ..." and I think, "well, then move to Utah and live in a cabin, if you're so shy. What are you doing, you know, putting yourself up there on a huge screen, and then expecting to be left alone?" It doesn't make sense.
I mean, I was a model, because I liked to show off. And that was a great way to show off! And that's the truth of it. For me at any rate. And when I stopped modeling, which I did before it was time to stop, I knew that much. You don't wait til people say "is she going to quit?" I quit right at the top.
And, that's when I, shortly thereafter started writing. I had never written before, didn't study writing at college. But thanks to a good prep school education, you know, and thanks to the fact that I am a voracious reader, I knew what good writing was and what bum writing was. so I could only aspire to write as best as I could, as well as I could.
And back to the modeling. If you like to show off, and writing was just another way to show off, if you like the attention and all the makeup and the hair people around you and all the rest of it, then go for it because the pay is terrific. And you get stared at, and you part the waves when you walk into a restaurant.
And, then there's the other side where people tend to think, "Well she's a model and that's all. She's not really a rocket scientist." I mean I wasn't a rocket scientist and I don't remember meeting any model that was. But I have met many many smart women in modeling. Smart, articulate, you know, terrific. I've met some I made friends with and some I couldn't stand. It's like any other occupation. you know, if you're an architect you like some and you don't like others. Or you're indifferent.
SFCB: Yeah, I think that there's this tendency for people to categorize people who are -- especially entertainers as people who ... they don't know anything. Anytime you see an actor come out with a political stance, everyone who is against that political stance will say, "Oh they're just an actor, what do they know?"
LEON BING: Well I think that they dare not say that about someone who is clearly as intelligent as [George] Clooney or [Ben] Affleck. I mean it's there to be seen. When Ben Affleck does an interview or goes on Bill Maher's show, or when George Clooney discusses politics, I mean Jesus, these are really smart guys, and very well informed, they know what they're talking about.
They have distinct points of view and know how to get their points across. Without using the star power aside from the fact that the star power gets them more attention. But it's not a bully pulpit.
I just remember when I was a model, and sometimes I'd be taken to a dinner, or asked to a small dinner party by someone in the industry who I knew of course, not well, but I was asked for a particular reason. Because very often at these dinner parties, they would end up getting into some ridiculous argument about history, of which is one of my favorite subjects.
And for the first 45 minutes of the dinner, people rather talked around me like I was some beautiful ornate chair, and therefore without opinions. And then there would ultimately be an opening, and I would step in. I wouldn't jump in, I wouldn't leap in, I'd just step in, because I knew I had my facts right and they didn't. And it was a great way to show off. And the best times would be when they played the movie game, which was always about old movies and the trivia, and then I would be brought in as what they called a ringer. Do you know what a ringer is?
SFCB: Yeah.
LEON BING: And so I would be the ringer, although not for money.
SFCB: Like Woody Harrelson in White Men Can't Jump. "You mean play basketball?"
LEON BING: (laughs) right. But there I was, the ringer. And so they'd talk about these old movies, and because one of my mother's husbands owned a number of theaters, I wrote about that, I saw more movies than anyone in the world. I was always in and out, in and out, in and out on the weekends, and when I got home from school. So I knew movies. And that was fun, because I could pretty well kill with trivia.
SFCB: So not just a pretty face.
LEON BING: (laughs). I look in the mirror and I think ... you know when I was modeling, I wore this great deal of elaborate makeup, you know, I applied it very carefully. And one time someone said "you know, you really ought to sign that when you're done." (laughs)
SFCB: (laughs) Just sign right there by your chin, "Leon Bing "
LEON BING: I mean I even painted the shadows of my lower lashes, not just the bold strokes but the tiny shadows. It took me over an hour. You know, even when there were makeup artists that would come in, I would make sure I had most of my stuff done, unless they wanted a particular look and then they could do it.
But, you know one remembers things. I mean I remember the tickle of Vidal's [Sassoon] breath on the back of my neck, when he would trim my hair in the dressing room, and how nice he was. I was sorry when he died last year, I liked his style. He was totally self made. There are many people I did like in fashion. For me at least it was a career or profession where I didn't have to worry about a glass ceiling. And pretty much I feel that writing is the same. If you write the words right it doesn't matter who you are. You know if you get the story.
And of course I am in favor of equal pay for women. That's only right.
You hear this about "Oh it's so boring", well, too bad! You get paid to be bored." You know? Bring a book! So you know I don't have a lot of patience for that. It's like the actor who says "Oh "I'm really so shy. I can't stand the bear the glare, or the eyes on ..." and I think, "well, then move to Utah and live in a cabin, if you're so shy. What are you doing, you know, putting yourself up there on a huge screen, and then expecting to be left alone?" It doesn't make sense.
I mean, I was a model, because I liked to show off. And that was a great way to show off! And that's the truth of it. For me at any rate. And when I stopped modeling, which I did before it was time to stop, I knew that much. You don't wait til people say "is she going to quit?" I quit right at the top.
And, that's when I, shortly thereafter started writing. I had never written before, didn't study writing at college. But thanks to a good prep school education, you know, and thanks to the fact that I am a voracious reader, I knew what good writing was and what bum writing was. so I could only aspire to write as best as I could, as well as I could.
And back to the modeling. If you like to show off, and writing was just another way to show off, if you like the attention and all the makeup and the hair people around you and all the rest of it, then go for it because the pay is terrific. And you get stared at, and you part the waves when you walk into a restaurant.
And, then there's the other side where people tend to think, "Well she's a model and that's all. She's not really a rocket scientist." I mean I wasn't a rocket scientist and I don't remember meeting any model that was. But I have met many many smart women in modeling. Smart, articulate, you know, terrific. I've met some I made friends with and some I couldn't stand. It's like any other occupation. you know, if you're an architect you like some and you don't like others. Or you're indifferent.
SFCB: Yeah, I think that there's this tendency for people to categorize people who are -- especially entertainers as people who ... they don't know anything. Anytime you see an actor come out with a political stance, everyone who is against that political stance will say, "Oh they're just an actor, what do they know?"
LEON BING: Well I think that they dare not say that about someone who is clearly as intelligent as [George] Clooney or [Ben] Affleck. I mean it's there to be seen. When Ben Affleck does an interview or goes on Bill Maher's show, or when George Clooney discusses politics, I mean Jesus, these are really smart guys, and very well informed, they know what they're talking about.
They have distinct points of view and know how to get their points across. Without using the star power aside from the fact that the star power gets them more attention. But it's not a bully pulpit.
I just remember when I was a model, and sometimes I'd be taken to a dinner, or asked to a small dinner party by someone in the industry who I knew of course, not well, but I was asked for a particular reason. Because very often at these dinner parties, they would end up getting into some ridiculous argument about history, of which is one of my favorite subjects.
And for the first 45 minutes of the dinner, people rather talked around me like I was some beautiful ornate chair, and therefore without opinions. And then there would ultimately be an opening, and I would step in. I wouldn't jump in, I wouldn't leap in, I'd just step in, because I knew I had my facts right and they didn't. And it was a great way to show off. And the best times would be when they played the movie game, which was always about old movies and the trivia, and then I would be brought in as what they called a ringer. Do you know what a ringer is?
SFCB: Yeah.
LEON BING: And so I would be the ringer, although not for money.
SFCB: Like Woody Harrelson in White Men Can't Jump. "You mean play basketball?"
LEON BING: (laughs) right. But there I was, the ringer. And so they'd talk about these old movies, and because one of my mother's husbands owned a number of theaters, I wrote about that, I saw more movies than anyone in the world. I was always in and out, in and out, in and out on the weekends, and when I got home from school. So I knew movies. And that was fun, because I could pretty well kill with trivia.
SFCB: So not just a pretty face.
LEON BING: (laughs). I look in the mirror and I think ... you know when I was modeling, I wore this great deal of elaborate makeup, you know, I applied it very carefully. And one time someone said "you know, you really ought to sign that when you're done." (laughs)
SFCB: (laughs) Just sign right there by your chin, "Leon Bing "
LEON BING: I mean I even painted the shadows of my lower lashes, not just the bold strokes but the tiny shadows. It took me over an hour. You know, even when there were makeup artists that would come in, I would make sure I had most of my stuff done, unless they wanted a particular look and then they could do it.
But, you know one remembers things. I mean I remember the tickle of Vidal's [Sassoon] breath on the back of my neck, when he would trim my hair in the dressing room, and how nice he was. I was sorry when he died last year, I liked his style. He was totally self made. There are many people I did like in fashion. For me at least it was a career or profession where I didn't have to worry about a glass ceiling. And pretty much I feel that writing is the same. If you write the words right it doesn't matter who you are. You know if you get the story.
And of course I am in favor of equal pay for women. That's only right.
SFCB: In recent
months we’ve heard some politicians voice these insane ideas such as women can’t get pregnant in the cases of “legitimate rape”, --
LEON BING: Oh yes, I know, because their bodies have a way to expel the fetus.
SFCB: Yeah, and they have a magical fairy way of shutting that whole thing down. Well this brings up the natural progression of that idea being that women who DO get pregnant in these situations, they must not have really been against it.
LEON BING: I think that this is beneath comment for me.
LEON BING: Oh yes, I know, because their bodies have a way to expel the fetus.
SFCB: Yeah, and they have a magical fairy way of shutting that whole thing down. Well this brings up the natural progression of that idea being that women who DO get pregnant in these situations, they must not have really been against it.
LEON BING: I think that this is beneath comment for me.
SFCB: Yeah, well what I mean though is that this idea has been around for awhile, dating back to Nazi death camp experiments, but it highlights a disconnect from reality that many people
seem to have where not only do people not get pregnant from rape, but that there are types of rape that are not real, such as date rape or marital rape. What do you attribute to this
ridiculous and reality deprived stance that are being put out there? This is something I just don’t seem to be
able to understand.
LEON BING: Well I have to attribute it to the individual who... what is his name? I just loathe him so much that I can't even remember his name.
SFCB: Todd Akin.
LEON BING: Yes, Akin. It's individual stuff, individual misogyny and ignorance that is nearly beneath comment. but if one does it's to get out of the public forum. Stop talking! Stop trying to make a "difference". You know he is shameful. His ideas are shameful. He is contemptible. And the idea that any woman who is raped is in charge of her body and is able to automatically discharge a fetus that comes from a rape is beyond absurd.
Akin needs to be gotten out of congress.
SFCB: Yeah it was crazy because his fellow Republicans kept trying to get him to get out of the race because they were like "We really need this seat" and he wasn't going anywhere. But I mean if he still wins even despite this...
LEON BING: No I doubt he can win, but who knows. My crystal ball is at the cleaners, so I don't know. I can only pray that he does not. But his ideas are so patently insane.
SFCB: Jon Stewart had a point on his show last night that was brilliant, although quite sad as well, that Akin is on a committee for science and technology.
LEON BING: Yeah.
SFCB: And so is that other guy that said that Evolution is a lie from the pits of Hell or whatever.
LEON BING: Yes, and the world is 6000 years old.
SFCB: And both of these guys are on the committee that deals with Science. Craziness. You know, o ne of the most interesting parts of your autobiography "Swans & Pistols: Modeling, Motherhood and Making it in the Me Generation", to me anyway, was your interactions with Mickey Cohen. I mean it wasn't that much of the book, but...
SFCB: Todd Akin.
LEON BING: Yes, Akin. It's individual stuff, individual misogyny and ignorance that is nearly beneath comment. but if one does it's to get out of the public forum. Stop talking! Stop trying to make a "difference". You know he is shameful. His ideas are shameful. He is contemptible. And the idea that any woman who is raped is in charge of her body and is able to automatically discharge a fetus that comes from a rape is beyond absurd.
Akin needs to be gotten out of congress.
SFCB: Yeah it was crazy because his fellow Republicans kept trying to get him to get out of the race because they were like "We really need this seat" and he wasn't going anywhere. But I mean if he still wins even despite this...
LEON BING: No I doubt he can win, but who knows. My crystal ball is at the cleaners, so I don't know. I can only pray that he does not. But his ideas are so patently insane.
SFCB: Jon Stewart had a point on his show last night that was brilliant, although quite sad as well, that Akin is on a committee for science and technology.
LEON BING: Yeah.
SFCB: And so is that other guy that said that Evolution is a lie from the pits of Hell or whatever.
LEON BING: Yes, and the world is 6000 years old.
SFCB: And both of these guys are on the committee that deals with Science. Craziness. You know, o ne of the most interesting parts of your autobiography "Swans & Pistols: Modeling, Motherhood and Making it in the Me Generation", to me anyway, was your interactions with Mickey Cohen. I mean it wasn't that much of the book, but...
LEON BING: (laughs) well, thanks! What do you mean?
SFCB: No, I mean what I meant was --
LEON BING: (laughs) I'm just messing with you.
SFCB: (laughs) okay. It wasn't a big portion of the book, but I was really interested in that, and the thing I thought was interesting was you talked about how the Mickey you knew was different from the Mickey that was written about in the papers.
LEON BING: Well, that's often the case, isn't it?
SFCB: Yeah.
LEON BING: I met him through my then husband, who had known Mickey since my husband was 18. My husband's step father had a very posh store in Beverly Hills which made custom made pajamas and shirts and dress and gowns, and all kinds of stuff for men. all to order.
And of course Mickey was just the type that wanted everything with a monogram and custom fit, and he was a very good customer. And like I wrote in the book, he came in, these two guys lounged at the counter, and he had come in particularly to see my husband and meet the bride, as he put it.
And then when I went back to LA to see my mom, because we lived in New York, he said "be sure to call me Mickey" which I did. And I found him to be gentlemanly and really loving, I mean in that old timey dillante way, and gallant. I mean he didn't kiss my hand or anything, but he was gallant. And it was just before he had to go to Alcatraz.
And I liked his girlfriend very much, and the chapter as you read it, is exactly as it happened. I liked him, I knew who and what he was, and I read in reviews how I seemed to like the bad boys. (laughs) Well, I was an eagle scout and had been for 10 years so, so much for the bad boys. It was a phase. And I wasn't married to Mickey, I was married to a television director.
I liked him because he was just ... I suppose in a way I was rather dazzled. I had never met a man of such reputation, although my step father was for all intents and purposes 'connected'.
SFCB: Yeah, I really liked that story with the money on the table and she had to keep clapping.
LEON BING: (laugh) Oh my mother, yeah I know!
SFCB: And then ended up dumping all that money on his lap and said " I don't steal!"
LEON BING: It was such a great true story, because knowing my mom as I did, she was really my best friend. I was nuts about my mother. She could really make me laugh, and vice versa. Just hearing her slap that thighs as she stuff that money in her bag, and then throw it all over his car, I just loved it. It's a great story.
SFCB: Yeah, I actually laughed out loud when I read that story, it was really funny.
LEON BING: well it's so unexpected. If you'd known my mother, you'd have to know how "Ransom School for G irls" she was. How beautifully she dressed, and how her voice was really, you know, most genteel. So for her to do that was really funny.
SFCB: I’ve always found that interesting because our society seems to frown on any multi-layered images of those we deem to be “the bad guys”.
LEON BING: Well, people like to have things as black and white in many cases, and I hope that is changing.
The show depicted the terrorists not as mindless evil minions, but as people who were doing evil things but they all had their own lives and their own lives and rationale for what they were doing. Right or wrong, they were portrayed as people just living in society, the leader was coaching little league, they’d have picnics and whatnot with family members.
LEON BING: Not unlike gang members.
SFCB: Right! And this controversy reminded me that our country doesn’t want to see those that we consider “bad people” as anything other than one dimensional “Terrorist #1 or #2” in an action movie. Motivations be damned, intentions be damned.
LEON BING: Well, I think that's changing. At least I hope so. I really don't think this country has remained entirely that naive. That it's either good or bad, and no in between. I'm sure it still exists in many quarters.
SFCB: And in the case of Mickey, he was very sweet with you, and he didn't really hide from you what he had done, and I loved that line of his of "I never killed anyone who didn't deserve it."
LEON BING: Oh i know! I know! (laughs) What a line?
SFCB: Yeah, he was just very upfront and blunt like "yeah...I did it, but they deserved it"
LEON BING: But he was not cavalier about it. He never said it in that way. Believe me, he was not cavalier, and I know cause I heard it.
SFCB: There has been
a lot of discussion by authors and readers about the advent of digital media as
it pertains to books. There are authors
who are steadfast against the idea of having their books be read on a digital
device like a Kindle or an iPad and see it as the downfall of literature, yet
begrudgingly submit their books for the medium, and then there are others who
wholeheartedly embrace it, and see it as the future.
Where do you fall in that debate?
LEON BING: Well I think it's probably very much the future, but I also feel that there will still be books. I think it's going to be much more limited, but I think there will still be... you know I still prefer the heft and the feel of a book. A real book in my hand. I've never, since I learned to read, picked up a book to read without smelling it. I love the smell of the paper and the ink.
SFCB: That is great.
LEON BING: Every book I pick out, it's automatic that I smell it. And then I read it. And my older books smell so wonderful. Not of mold, I take very good care of my books. I don't dogear a book, and when I find a dogeared page in a library book I have a fit. I use bookmarks, because I read more than one book at a time.
But how I feel about it [Digital Media] makes little difference, it is what it is. Will there be more books on Kindle and iPad, of course there will. They can hold a thousand one hundred books! People won't be schlepping books from place to place and many people like that. You know me, I move every book myself and put it away before I move. I mean I don't do it alphabetically, I'm not that OCD. (laughs) But I still know where, I'd say, 94% of my books are. I can go right to a book.
Where do you fall in that debate?
LEON BING: Well I think it's probably very much the future, but I also feel that there will still be books. I think it's going to be much more limited, but I think there will still be... you know I still prefer the heft and the feel of a book. A real book in my hand. I've never, since I learned to read, picked up a book to read without smelling it. I love the smell of the paper and the ink.
SFCB: That is great.
LEON BING: Every book I pick out, it's automatic that I smell it. And then I read it. And my older books smell so wonderful. Not of mold, I take very good care of my books. I don't dogear a book, and when I find a dogeared page in a library book I have a fit. I use bookmarks, because I read more than one book at a time.
But how I feel about it [Digital Media] makes little difference, it is what it is. Will there be more books on Kindle and iPad, of course there will. They can hold a thousand one hundred books! People won't be schlepping books from place to place and many people like that. You know me, I move every book myself and put it away before I move. I mean I don't do it alphabetically, I'm not that OCD. (laughs) But I still know where, I'd say, 94% of my books are. I can go right to a book.
SFCB: When I first got one of the original Kindles I was excited
about the idea of reading on there, just because it was something new. You can’t beat the real thing though, and
holding the book in your hand, turning the pages, smelling it, you can’t replace that.
However in the area of quantity?
I have an iPad with 64GB of memory on it and that will hold a whole
library of books.
LEON BING: See, that's wonderful!
SFCB: And that's not to mention the ones that are stored in the cloud that don’t count against the storage cap. While I like the idea of feeling the book in my hands, smelling the paper and that “new book smell”, --
LEON BING: But what if you lose it? I would go insane!
SFCB: Yeah there's that. But there’s also something to be said for carrying thousands of books in your pocket or in your backpack. And I used to be homeless, so the idea of having all those thousands of books at your fingertips, it's kind of enticing I have to say.
LEON BING: See, that's wonderful!
SFCB: And that's not to mention the ones that are stored in the cloud that don’t count against the storage cap. While I like the idea of feeling the book in my hands, smelling the paper and that “new book smell”, --
LEON BING: But what if you lose it? I would go insane!
SFCB: Yeah there's that. But there’s also something to be said for carrying thousands of books in your pocket or in your backpack. And I used to be homeless, so the idea of having all those thousands of books at your fingertips, it's kind of enticing I have to say.
LEON BING: Well of course it is. One imagines standing in line at the DMV with a Kindle, it's so much easier.
SFCB: So do you ever see yourself getting one?
LEON BING: Sure! Of course I'll get one. I mean there's other things that take precedence, but of course I'll get one. And I'll use it until I get tired of it, and if I don't get tired of it I'll just keep using it. But I will always buy books. I live in a city that is a book city. There are dozens of wonderful book stores and used book stores. My mother wouldn't even walk into a book store with me because that's two hours to three hours gone like that.
Fortunately I'm with someone now who's just like me. And we'll both go into the store and go our separate ways, and meet every hour, and just keep going.
SFCB: So do you ever see yourself getting one?
LEON BING: Sure! Of course I'll get one. I mean there's other things that take precedence, but of course I'll get one. And I'll use it until I get tired of it, and if I don't get tired of it I'll just keep using it. But I will always buy books. I live in a city that is a book city. There are dozens of wonderful book stores and used book stores. My mother wouldn't even walk into a book store with me because that's two hours to three hours gone like that.
Fortunately I'm with someone now who's just like me. And we'll both go into the store and go our separate ways, and meet every hour, and just keep going.
SFCB: It’s been
almost four years now since you wrote “Swans & Pistols”. Do you ever get the urge to write another, or
do you think you’ve written your last book?
LEON BING: No, I don't think I've written my last book. But I have a proposal with my agent, for another book. It's an unbelievable story.
SFCB: Alright, well I'm definitely happy about that. Although I can't imagine what horrible thing that you're writing about this time. (laughs)
LEON BING: Well, it's just really an astonishing story. And it's true of course. My agent likes it, and he's very tough to please. And Gareth likes it and he's very tough to please, and I like it and I'm VERY tough to please. (laughs)
SFCB: Well alright, I'm looking forward to seeing that in the stores some day.
LEON BING: Well, you know I have to get the advance, and then I have to sit down and write it. It'll probably be about a year. It takes about a year. Do or Die took longer because I had to do about a year of research for the book. You know I had never been in that world before so I had to learn stuff. It was a whole new language. I don't speak gang, but I understand it fluently.
SFCB: Right.
LEON BING: It's like learning French, you have to learn a whole new language.
SFCB: Well it [Do or Die] was a very engrossing book.
LEON BING: I'm glad you liked it. I'm glad you liked all my writings because you're a big reader.
SFCB: Alright, well I'm definitely happy about that. Although I can't imagine what horrible thing that you're writing about this time. (laughs)
LEON BING: Well, it's just really an astonishing story. And it's true of course. My agent likes it, and he's very tough to please. And Gareth likes it and he's very tough to please, and I like it and I'm VERY tough to please. (laughs)
SFCB: Well alright, I'm looking forward to seeing that in the stores some day.
LEON BING: Well, you know I have to get the advance, and then I have to sit down and write it. It'll probably be about a year. It takes about a year. Do or Die took longer because I had to do about a year of research for the book. You know I had never been in that world before so I had to learn stuff. It was a whole new language. I don't speak gang, but I understand it fluently.
SFCB: Right.
LEON BING: It's like learning French, you have to learn a whole new language.
SFCB: Well it [Do or Die] was a very engrossing book.
LEON BING: I'm glad you liked it. I'm glad you liked all my writings because you're a big reader.
SFCB: Leon, I
want to think you so very much for taking the time out of your day to do it,
and I wish you and yours nothing but the best.
LEON BING: Oh it was a pleasure, and we will keep in touch!
SFCB: Absolutely, have a wonderful day.
LEON BING: Oh it was a pleasure, and we will keep in touch!
SFCB: Absolutely, have a wonderful day.
Thanks for taking the time to interview me, Gary. And I KNOW how difficult and time consuming it is to do all that transcribing when it's a phone interview.
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